Spirit descriptions

[ash]

ok lads.

I just read "about ghosts" description on the menu.

the first two are great and I think was discussed in detail at boards, but I find the "demons and elementals" is a little off the scale.

"This third type of ghost is the rarest of all, it is thought that these spirits never lived a mortal existance. These are dangerous spirits and will cause you harm if they can. They may take on the guise of human spirits and appear friendy. They are othen associated with Ouija boards which is why this is an unsafe method of trying to contact spirits."

The negative energies conjured through association with ouija boards is no different to "spirit entities". The good the bad and the ugly. (IME)

I don't gel with the whole elementals description. Can we discuss?
( I know kennett mentioned this before in relation to one of the investigations) I'm just curious as to where this information originated.

L&L

[DaveMcG]

The description seems pretty spot on to me.

[Andrew]

As far as I know, elementals are usually manifestations of negative energy... Such as what's at Leap Castle, due to all the murders. Demons, from what I have been told can be both good and bad, and they're keepers of knowledge, and according to the DCMAG/TAPS website, demon presence can be defined by the smell of rotten meat, of which I encountered with a friend in Charleville, well the grounds outside where there is supposed to be a "druids grotto", when in fact it was a tea room. It's not really detailed, but it's just a little bit of info.

I do agree however, that demons and elementals are separate entities altogether....

[Ryan]

We will be expanding on those descriptions and adding additional info. If you have anything to add I would be happy to considder it.

[ash]

As far as I know, elementals are usually manifestations of negative energy... Such as what's at Leap Castle,

yep, this type of condensed energy (lots of negativity in one place) can open up what is referred to as "portals", vortices of energy. I suppose in this translation I can comprehend this as what is referred to as elementals.

Demons?....demons is just another negative type entity. To say they have never lived seems a tad paradoxical, as to live is to know good and bad. (the reference to the smell of rotting meat also indicates it is of the flesh) The polarisations of good and bad, come from being human. Esoterically speaking, the only elements to never have "lived" are angelic.
you might be better able to consider this energy (angelic), as formed of the original makeup of the universe, (divine source) conscious energy which has never been made manifest in physical shape or form. Therefore it knows no good or bad.

...still thinking...


Demons were often referred to in the bible and used as descriptions of "unclean spirits".
I suppose that there are a type of entity which choose to remain "earthbound", and who sustain themselves by feeding off the energy supplied in its relavant location.
They have probably been around for a long time too, and have no intertest in "moving on".

[DaveMcG]

To say they have never lived seems a tad paradoxical, as to live is to know good and bad.

I think by "live" it means to physically live. To have a physical body.

Andrew, I would be very wary of associating a smell of rotting flesh in an outdoor location to a demon or elemental. Due to the fact that you experienced this event in an outdoor location it could simply have been a dead animal nearby that produced the smell of decay. Also, becuase you were outside there are a lot of air currents which could carry smells into the vicinity very quickly, and then the smell could go away just as fast when the wind direction changed. I'm not saying that what you experienced couldn't have been an evil spirit but there are a lot of other factors which should be considered when dealing with locations which are not indoors, and thus are less protected against naturally occuring events.

[ash]

I have heard other stories where the smell of decaying flesh accompanies paranormal instances. A friend of mine moved into a new house some years ago and was experiencing "poltergeist" type activity. Waking up in the morning to find cupboards open, lights turning on and off and they always complained of the really bad smell that lingered in the house. They did have drainage checked and all was well.
(they had the house blessed and still live there 15 years on-smell left too)

I agree with dave though, on an investigative level, all avenues must be considered.

[Ryan]

Moved to lounge as this is no longer a support issue.

[DaveMcG]

A "phantom smell" manifesting itself indoors is far more compelling evidence, seeing as there is a far less chance of a natural smell entering the house on the wind, especially when the doors and windows are closed.
An outdoor enviroment is so full of natural smells that it would be very hard to prove a smell was paranormal unless it was accompanied with some other evidence such as light anomolies or sudden temperature changes etc.

[Andrew]

Andrew, I would be very wary of associating a smell of rotting flesh in an outdoor location to a demon or elemental. Due to the fact that you experienced this event in an outdoor location it could simply have been a dead animal nearby that produced the smell of decay. Also, becuase you were outside there are a lot of air currents which could carry smells into the vicinity very quickly, and then the smell could go away just as fast when the wind direction changed. I'm not saying that what you experienced couldn't have been an evil spirit but there are a lot of other factors which should be considered when dealing with locations which are not indoors, and thus are less protected against naturally occuring events.

It wasn't completely outdoors though. It was outdoors in an enclosed location, like that "druid's grotto", which was a teahouse. Marklar was with us at the time, and he smelt it too. Basically, we smelt it around the "couch" area, then Marklar cried after sniffing that area, and he ran off. So, if it was a dead anmal, I'm sure Marklar would have stayed.

That said, fair play for the rational response :)

Edit: I should have mentioned the torturer, who goes by the name of O'Reilly. It was said he made a pact with the devil. I was aware of being watched all the time, and being followed by a dark presence.

[Andrew]

A "phantom smell" manifesting itself indoors is far more compelling evidence, seeing as there is a far less chance of a natural smell entering the house on the wind, especially when the doors and windows are closed.
An outdoor enviroment is so full of natural smells that it would be very hard to prove a smell was paranormal unless it was accompanied with some other evidence such as light anomolies or sudden temperature changes etc.

The area around the couch was pretty enclosed from why I saw, since it was facing away from the door. As I mentioned before, my friend and I both smelt it, and Marklar did a runner when he smelt it at well, so we decided to leave pretty sharpish. That said, I think there may be something in there...

[DaveMcG]

Interesting that Marklar ran away though. Usually a dog would be interested in the smell of rotting meat, not frightened by it! ;)

[Adrienne]

Hi Guys, hope you can give me rational explanation to whats going on in my house! We moved in a year ago. We have two small kids who generally sleep all night. Twice or three times a week we are woken by a child crying/sobbing. When we check our kids the are sound asleep with soothers in their mouths! We jokingly refered to this as the phantom child.

Last night we were awoken to a very load dull thump against the ensuite wall. We checked our son who sleeps the other side of the wall just in case and he was asleep with soother. The thump was that big that it hopped the towel radiator that my husband was fixing off the pipes (hadn't been connected to pipes but attached to wall) and left it hanging from the wall fittings. My husband is convinced that something is going on as he gets up regularly to our youngest son screaming/crying hysterically. This is becomming more regular in the past month. Can anyone figure this out please.

[DaveMcG]

Hi Adrienne,
What you are describing is very strange. It seems pretty obvious that your own children are not the cause of this activity, as they are sound asleep when you check on them after hearing the noises. Is your house detached or semi-detached house? If the latter, does the house built onto yours have any young children living in it? If so is it possible that the neighbours children are the cause of the crying and you are hearing the noise through the walls?
That may seem like a ridiculous question, but if we can rule that out it might make it easier to narrow the cause down. :)
The thump on the wall which caused the towel rad to fall is very interesting as I presume quite a substantial force would be required to cause this to happen.
Also it is quite common for paranormal activity to center around young children(especially if the spirit of a child is involved).

How old is your house? Do you know anything about its history?

[Adrienne]

Hi Dave, unfortunately my house is detatched with access on both sides of the house so it couldn't be next door. What I do know is that the house is 6 years old and based in between Navan and Mullingar. I am trying to find out who the builders bought the land off. While my husband was reading the bedtime stories this evening I thumped the wall on my son's side which connects to the ensuite and heard the radiator jump a bit. This could be read that my 5yr old son did it in his sleep (which I hope) but in saying that it was a good thump I gave it and surely the child would have woken with a sore arm or hand after that instead he was sound asleep with his soother. Is this odd or is it my imagination gone wild?

My other son (4) who wakes almost every night with night terrors was perched on the headboard crying a short time ago - maybe it's his wild imagination like his mothers!! I don't know whats going on here if indeed anything is, I definatlely can't explain the phantom crying child and I suppose that is what is bugging me. There are no hot spots/cold spots in the house and no bad atomsphere. Also I have three cats who are still with me inspite of all this - surely if there was something bad going on they would sense it? In case there is a phantom child I have called it Sam for now as that covers a male and female name. A friend reckons that it is a child looking for attention and when it gets it like now is happy and lies low for a while and then pops up again - can this happen? Will see what if anything happens over the weekend and be in touch.

[Ryan]

Hi Adrienne,
I have been reading your story with interest, Has this problem only started recently? Have your Children given you any indication about why they are crying? and do you or your family get any strange feelings like someone is watching you or standing behind you? Sorry if they seem like strange questions.
We will try to help you out as much as possible and any additional information no matter how trivial it may seem would be helpfull also if you would like to discuss this in a private room on this forum with just you and the investigation team at any stage please say so. Also if you feel it would help you, PRAI offers a free and totally confidential investigation of your property if you want to go down that route.

Good luck

Ryan

[fennellp]

Hi Adrienne.
Is their any history to your house? Maybe you could make some enquires about previous owners of the house and see if they had a troubled past. It might throw some light onto who or what is causing the crying. With ref to the thumping on the radiator what kind of central heating do you have? Sometimes trapped air moving through a heating system will cause pipes to vibrate and make loud noises as the air moves. Try bleading your radiators to see if their is some trapped air.

Hope this helps.

Paul.

[Adrienne]

Thank you both (Paul and Ryan) for your replies. We had another incident last night while the kids were asleep. We were down in the kitchen and we heard someone running around upstairs - which isn't unusual but when we went up to check them they were both asleep. We checked them properly in case they were messing. My husband reminded me of a couple of weeks ago when I was alone in the house and in the shower, I heard thumping coming from the wardrobe side and thought it was a bloody cat stuck. When I got out there was nothing in the wardrobe and no pipes behind that wall and checked the house was empty. Our heating system is oil fired but not on yet and besides the raditaor in the ensuite isn't even connected! We are doing small renovations/decorating etc and someone suggested that 'Sammy' doesn't like being disturbed with change, someone else suggested that 'Sammy' is looking for attention like a spoilt kid. What's holding me back from getting it checked out properly is the fact that my three cats are still around and acting fairly normal for cats - surely they would sense something. I had booked tickets for Derek Acorah (Thurs) before this really took off and now am a bit anxious about going. Have mentioned to my husband about bleeding the rads and he said he'd do it tonight but that he definatly thinks is not that and more like something thumping off the plasterboard.

[DaveMcG]

By the sounds of it, the activity is getting more and more numerous and I think your theory that this may be caused by the fact that your currently doing renovations is very sound. It is quite common for active buildings to become more active if the building is disturbed by building work or renovations.
The incident with you hearing someone running up the stairs is very interesting, as this would be hard to explain away as simple common noises such as pipes etc.
As for ths cats, I remember one of the psychics in Charleville saying that cats are not as sensitive to spirits as dogs, and also that they don't seem to care about it as much as dogs. In other words, even if a cat did sense a spirit it wouldn't necessarily change its behaviour, whereas a dog might bark at a seemingly invisible person or run away scared etc. Andy, could you verify that as I think you were also there when the psychic talked to abou this.

My advice would be to go and see Derek Acorah and you might even get a chance to ask him for his advice about this. You never know! :)

[fennellp]

Adrienne.
It’s good that we are eliminating the heating system,
Part of a paranormal investigation it to systematically examine each part of the goings-on to find answer’s for them.
I agree with Dave, building work been carried out in a reported haunted location can cause a reaction either in the form of a play back, like a video of an event that would of happened their to re play its self over and over again or cause the spirits to make their feelings known about the work been done.
But what I feel from what you are saying is that “Sammy “ does not mean you or your family any harm. I feel it is looking for attention, just letting you know I am here.
If you have a good digital camera take some picks in the dark of the rooms that you feel have activity in them when you hear noises in them and look at them closely, what you would be looking for is sphere like orbs or other unusual mists or lights.

I will also be at the Derek Acorah show on 23 and I am looking forward to it.

Paul.

[Adrienne]

Hi Guys, you are all very helpful and I truly appreciate it. We are also checking the attic tonight for rats/mice/birds etc and wall cavaties for the same so we can rule all them out. I mentioned the digital camera to hubby and he wants to know does he use the flash on or off when taking photo (basic question I know but we really don't have much of a clue about all this).

I definately feel that 'Sammy' doesn't want to harm anyone and is looking for attention, it seems in the past week or two the crying has eased and the thumping increased, hopefully that is as far as Sammy will go. Someone told me to get a priest in but I don't want to go down that road until I know what I am dealing with. If hubby mangaes to get any photos that I am not sure of can I email them to you for a more experienced opinion?

Regards

A xx

[Ryan]

When your taking photos try to take some with and some without a flash. Good luck also if you have a tape recorder or video camera leave it recording to see if you can catch anything on tape.

[DaveMcG]

Also, one piece of advice when taking photos is to be wary of "orbs". Its very rare for orbs caught on digital cameras to be actually paranormal. 90% of the time there are simple explanations such as dust, moisture, insects, light refractions etc.
As a general rule, if you catch an "orb" in a photo first see if it is mostly transparent and not very bright, if so, chances are it is not paranormal and more likely dust reflecting the light from the flash.
Its actually very simple to reproduce these types of orbs, just turn off the lights in a room, then try and get some dust into the air by hitting the cushions on a couch or something similar, then immediately take a photo. You should finds dozens of orbs in the photo.

More compelling photographic evidence is strange mists(make sure no-one is smoking at the time of taking the photo though), or light streaks.

Give it a try though and see if anything turns up. We would be happy to take a look at any photos in which you think anything is out of the ordinary and try to give you an explanation....if there is one. ;)

Good luck!

[ash]

:d
:)
:p

[ash]

couldn't think of anything constructive to say.
Nice name Sammy, Derek will be impressed.

;)

[Adrienne]

Hi again! Well nothing happened last night, and it's peeved me off now! There I was all set up and ready with digital camera cat napping all night and nothing! Think sammy knew what I was at and is playing games. Didnt get to check attic or bleed rads, hubby got caught up with work and wont get to until weekend. Unfortunately, typical female me doesn't do mice rats or birds or heights and can't do allen key.

btw, the lights did flicker in ensuite last night which we both saw but to be honest I think that was more of an electrical fault due to the very strong wind last night.

Adrienne

[DaveMcG]

That tends to happen...... ;)
The best thing to do would be keep the camera near to you when you sleep and if your woken by noises take a few photos of the area where they came from.

[Adrienne]

Hi, all was well last night until 11ish. I was in bed and hubby was working at laptop downstairs with tv on and washingmachine on. I heard a thump crash noise but couldn't place it in the house. Hubby didn't hear a thing as there was a lot of noise where he was anyway. I should have gotten up and checked it with camera but I bottled out and rang hubby's mobile instead and he proceeded to work upstairs as opposed to downstairs. Will try to be braver tonight. Hubby thinks I've lost the plot totally and should just leave it!

Adrienne

[ash]

only two days till you get to see Derek Acorah. I'm sure will find some peace of mind there.
(I wanna go now)

[Andrew]

Andy, could you verify that as I think you were also there when the psychic talked to about this.

I don't recall specifically, but as a cat owner myself, I can verify that in general, cats don't seem to be so bothered compared to dogs, as yes... That's right, now I remember! Cats aren't bothered so much because they're familiars, but that said, my cat Magenta seems to notice presences, as she sometimes stares and meows at thin air. Oddly enough, I have felt a few chills as well when I'm there, so I'm guessing that she senses things. Catapuss is different though... She'd walk right through the ex-person, I figure... The psychics said that, and this is one of the reasons the cat just pretty much strolled to us during that seance, as they're not that bothered about ghosts/spirits...

[Andrew]

Interesting that Marklar ran away though. Usually a dog would be interested in the smell of rotting meat, not frightened by it! ;)

That's true... That would have to mean someone, or something was there... That said, the who time my friend and I were with Marklar walking to the grotto, I knew we were being followed... My back tingled like crazy!



btw, the lights did flicker in ensuite last night which we both saw but to be honest I think that was more of an electrical fault due to the very strong wind last night.

Adrienne


Funny you should mention that, because in my house, the lights in the bathroom upstairs flicker and I'm beginning to associate this more and more with a ghost that I have too, since the electrics there were fixed. I figure that at that time, an EM Field may be present. Do you ever feel cold spots while the lights flicker or a shiver down your spine? That could also indicate a presence.

That said, this generally uses your intuition, so it may or may not work the way I say... You may get something different. Sometimes, my hands "creak" if I put them near a strong energy source, but that said even though I know all this, I'm still learning, so I'm not going to declare this as 100% accurate, rather something to try or consider.

[DaveMcG]

There are dozens and dozens of possible "normal" explanations for lights flickering. Even if your wiring is sound, a simple power surge in the town\area can cause it, weather, a dodgy lightbulb, a dodgy lightswitch, a faulty tripswitch\fuse, a power drain in the house due to too many appliances using the power etc etc. The list goes on. I would say 99% of the times a light flickers it is not due to anything paranormal. ;)
Now if the light flickering coincides with another seemingly paranormal event, like unexplained noises, a genuine cold spot, phantom smell, etc than it can be considered more as being paranormal. But by itself it can't be acceptable as evidence of the paranormal.

Just something the keep in mind.... :)

[ash]

so c'mon..out with it. All those priviledged enough to go see him, what did Derek Acorah have to say?

[fennellp]

He was fantastic a true master of the psychic world, made connections with people in audience from the spirit world, some deep connections other just ok. First half of his show was by far the best. But did enjoy the question section at the end where he invited people to ask him anything about the paranormal world. Bought his new book there and yes got him to sign it, well he signed books for anyone who wished no matter how long the queue, had a little chat with him as he was sinning it. He is a true gent, pity not more like him around.

[ash]

awww...might get to see him in the future, sounds like a good night was had by all. Wonder did Adrienne get any info about sammy.

[Adrienne]

HI Guys, Sorry I havn't been around, ended up in Navan hospital on Wednesday night with severe womens problems!! Managed to get out at 5pm and got changed at out to see Derek Acorah. He was excellent, loved the oul dolls in the audience and was amazing, have to admit he has me hook line and sinker now! Anyway, didn't get to ask him anything but got another lead on sammy - could be a family member mucking about from other side!! Nothing has happened since Wednesday night, but this is normal for sammy too. It takes a break for a few weeks and then starts up again. It started with the crying and then moved onto the thumping which is when I contacted you guys, if sammy comes back throwing things you will all hear me calling you by your user names to get down here quick!!!

[DaveMcG]

Keep us updated! :)

[ian]

Hi Adrienne,

I have been reading your situation with great interest. As the rest of the team have said, ruling out the natural occourances is the first step. When we enter a residence on a private investigation we check any natural causes first and get baselines for them. That is we check the EMF, temp, lighting etc while nothing is happening so if anything does change we know it.

If you would like an investigation of the house, we do ofer this free, discreat service. All you need to do is fill in this form (http://www.paranormalireland.org/downloads/PRAIRequest.doc) and mail it on to us at investigate@praofi.org, or call us on the number on the "contact" page.

Hope we can help

Ian

[Adrienne]

Hi Ian,

Thanks very much for the offer, unfortunately things have quietened down again, if and when things start happening I will let you know straight away.

Regards

Adrienne

[ash]

glad all is well Adrienne, with any luck things will remain peaceful from here on in.

:)

[Adrienne]

Hi Ash,

What are you doing up so early?????? Are you nuts????

I hope whatever it is/was that was happening in my house stays calm and preferably away for good. Like I said before, love all this stuff but not in my house thanks!!

A xx :rolleyes:

[ash]

I stay up late talking to dead people...on teh interweb.

;)

[MR LOONEY]

:confused: l guys just read through the posts about the elemental just a question apart from leap is there any other location in ireland with one of the same force as this one?. what im asking is can some be weak and some be very strong?.to avoid the danger that is associated with them can you outwit them and what would you use?.mr looney

[Adrienne]

Hi Guys,

Well, things are still happening in my house, the usual bumps and thumps. I haven't posted about them as it was nothing new to report. I did dream about where the remains of this thing is and was very distressed but that probably had nothing to do with the thumps etc, just the whole situation playing on my mind. If anything more sinister happens I will contact you directly for an investigation.

Regards

Adrienne

[Ryan]

Hi Guys,

Well, things are still happening in my house, the usual bumps and thumps. I haven't posted about them as it was nothing new to report. I did dream about where the remains of this thing is and was very distressed but that probably had nothing to do with the thumps etc, just the whole situation playing on my mind. If anything more sinister happens I will contact you directly for an investigation.

Regards

Adrienne
Hi Adrienne,

If you think you might need to go down the road of having us conduct an investigation it might be an idea to start keeping a log of what's been happening. Just make a note of anything strange that happens.

Regards

[Satori]

Hi Adrienne,
Such manifestations are rarely a issue of danger and it appears that many spirits are indeed aware of our interaction with them.

Have you considered that the sounds may be there to draw your attention?
What activity are you partaking in just before or at the time of these experiences?
and have you tried actively asking whats the matter?
Many people go to great lengths before doing this (safety is another issue) although at times it can relly be that simple, after all they are indeed people, or more that persons energy matrix.

psychologicaly if you become aware of your actions and the reactions within the house you can come to a deeper understanding of what part that .not only what the possible spirit holds in the haunting but also the role you play in it.

By simply interacting with whats happening you can not only descover any natural means of such occurances, you can also put your own mind at ease, and if indeed it is a discarnet spirit maybe you can finaly come to fully acknowlage its existance and perhaps help it in its evolution from one form of existance to another.

Love and light
Satori